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Thread: ROH Revisited: A Totally Non-Corona Related Marketh Reviews Comeback

  1. #121
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    Re: ROH Revisited: A Totally Non-Corona Related Marketh Reviews Comeback

    Best In The World 2011
    ROH World Championship
    Eddie Edwards vs. Davey Richards




    https://www.bilibili.com/video/BV1mt411o7aS/

    Well, I had to get around to this at some point. I can't not revisit the biggest match, the biggest moment, of one of ROH's most polarising figures during a transitional time they may have never fully settled into.

    To the ROH faithful, Davey Richards is one of two things. He was the elite workrate athlete that kept their tradition of pure, hard-hitting wrestling and competition alive, defying the pressure to shift towards a sports entertainment product when new owners Sinclair Broadcast Group wanted to bring ROH into the mainstream. OR, he was the worst thing to happen to the main event scene and sunk standards with forced epic, overblown, emotionless matches and inconsistent psychology, then influenced his peers into following this formula because ROH crowds couldn't go back to basics now this was the establishment. Despite not winning the title until this match, Davey was most definitely groomed as the face of the company for a while beforehand and feasibly could've been given the belt on several opportunities before this. The title change just feels inevitable, so at least they can wring a story with some drama out of him having to defeat his partner, Eddie Edwards.

    I was a huge Eddie Edwards fan. If you judge a book by its cover, he's very similar to Davey, however Eddie actually became his antithesis. His ascension from jobber status to uppercarder endeared him to the fans, especially since his career is littered with genuine, organic, feelgood moments like competing in Ladder War II with a broken elbow, earning respect from many for his toughness. The biggest moment was obviously his title win and becoming the first ever Triple Crown champ, which is easily up there as one of the most shocking and unexpected wins ever in ROH - he sold it like he was as surprised as we were, bless him. He's a complete introvert with a plain look, but there's a quiet, relatable charm to him where his passion and determination came through as real without needing to yell at the camera. Davey's promo style is like this too, but Eddie's personality is just more likeable. This subtlety would often be mistaken for blandness and Eddie's popularity growth was gradual, in the background - the result of consistently performing great in singles and tags, at any card position, with any style of opponent. (I doubt you can find them anywhere now, but he'd have really good TV title defences against unexpected workers like Rhett Titus, Necro Butcher and Shawn Daivari, as examples of how versatile he was) But going into the SBG era, he's definitely not seen as marketable. Either they decided to make him champion only to build to the drama of partners fighting over it, or they decided to get it off him and around Davey's waist ASAP once the new TV deal was established.

    BITW 2011 is intended to mark the beginning of the SBG era and ROH want to crown Davey as their undisputed #1 going forward. I remember watching this live and being fucking exhausted. There was a really long fourway tag title match beforehand and it was getting really early in the morning. It felt like they got into the finishing stretch really early and kept it at that pace forever and I kept drifting in and out of boredom at the length and excitement for the spots. So unfortunately, I'm pretty cynical going into this revisit.

    Quote Originally Posted by Marketh in 2011
    I can tell a few people here might shit all over this match, and maybe I was affected by the excitement of it being live, but I thought this match was bloody excellent.
    Funny how memory works, aye?

    You can tell it's a special occasion because Davey's got shiny new pants. The crowd is evenly split, but it's not massively loud. I'm certain they're drained from the 40min tag right before this. It's also babyface vs babyface without much heat in the buildup. The first big pop is for an exchange of strikes that ends with a really stiff-sounding running kick to Eddie's chest. One story element I'll definitely argue is present is that this was clearly a battle between them to prove their friendship won't get in the way of their individual desires for the ROH World Championship. Kinda depressing in the real world, no? So it's not long after the Code of Honor that we're already seeing them kick the shit out of each other. It's like a game of chicken of which one is willing to kill their best friend to be the better man...or some shit. It's only about 10 minutes in when they start getting into their signature spots and submissions, abandoning a traditional shine-heat-comeback structure. The majority of the match is the finishing sequence. It's very back-and-forth of some cool or strong moves and the crowd is digging it, as they often were before the Davey bubble burst, but I have no engagement in this at all yet.

    Eddie stomps on Davey's face repeatedly but it's not sold as being nearly as brutal as it looked. Eddie hits his knee on the guardrail during a Moonsault off the apron, setting up an injury he'll maintain throughout. They end up on the apron for some reason and Eddie hits a nasty looking 2k1 Bomb on the hardest part of the ring. It gets a big pop for a few seconds then crowd settles back down. Shortly followed by him double stomping Davey through a table, which gets a bigger pop...and then they settle down again. It's pretty disappointing seeing huge spots like these only get brief reactions but I'm not blaming the crowd entirely. Davey catches Eddie's leg in the ropes, where he'd typically do a Dragon Screw but there's a hesitation. Eddie starts slapping him and loudly daring him to do it. You're not trapped, dude. Just fight out of it or counter it in some way. It's an attempt at drama that the pro-Davey side can use as evidence this match tells a good story, but it makes no sense to me that 1. Davey would even hesitate when he's been the most eager to fight thus far and 2. Eddie assumed he had no control of this outcome.

    I'm not going as far as to say I'm bored, because they're doing some great spots that would look great in a highlight reel, but there's no genuine drama here. It's like all they discussed in the back was what bumps and sequences they wanted to do and what order they should do them in. What's especially annoying is I know Eddie is better than this, but clearly Davey is calling it. Eddie has the Achilles Lock and then a Cloverleaf for a while, but no one's buying them. The crowd is still definitely more enthusiastic than I am, though. They go back-and-forth chops vs kicks, which I always hated. Look, I've never taken a chop from a professional wrestler before, but I'd be willing to bet it's preferable to taking a kick. So this exchange bugs the shit out of me whenever I see it because it because it's presented as they're evenly strong. Am I wrong here?

    Eddie kicks out at 1 from a Lariat, it's not the reaction such a spot should have, but they've blown their load with apron and table bumps already so of course the crowd wasn't buying this nearfall. The finish is something I woke up for and stood up from my seat at the time and still did now, because it is fucked. Echoing the Flair/Michaels "I'm sorry, I love you", Davey tells Eddie "You'll always be my brother". As far as storytelling goes, this is one attempt that actually kinda works for me but is so non-existent in the rest of the match that it's not nearly as impactful as it should be. Then Davey (apparently) shoot punts Eddie in the head and WTF that looked like an instant concussion! Eddie appears to be talking and acting normal after, so hopefully he was fine. I don't know why this didn't get the huge reaction it deserved, maybe it wasn't clear from a distance how fucking nasty this looked. And then Davey gets the win. I think this would have been more effective if they made it appear more like that was no possible way for him to defeat Eddie other than this, but it just felt like "Ok, time for the finish".

    The video cuts off here, but I do remember that Davey did get genuinely emotional in his promo afterwards. I may not get emotionally invested in a match like this, but my God, he definitely did as he looks up to the skies and calls out in tears "Hey Grandma, hey Grandpa! I DID IT!" It's hard not to feel a bit happy for someone when they have a human moment like this, even if you felt nothing for the match that came before it. This helped me the Eddie Edwards mark in me forgive this booking decision. Yeah, I don't know what else I can say I haven't already said throughout this. I can probably watch a Moves That Make Me Go Holy Shit! video and get the experience I got from this match. It was like an experiment in seeing if they could go big from the start and maintain it for 35 minutes, but the problem is I need to feel like a match is escalating and building towards a climax and I want to have reasons to want someone to win. Telling a coherent, effective story wasn't the priority. I've been VERY critical of Davey here, but I actually don't think he was typically as bad as this because I often found myself defending him on WC. This is definitely one of the worst examples of him and clearly self-indulgent of what he thought wrestling should be evolving into. This is his Quentin Tarantino's Death Proof, he was given free reign to work the match he wanted, and his biggest marks loved it and the haters kept on hating. I'm sure Jim Cornette was in the back blowing a fuse at this style. The only real positive I have for it is I wasn't as worn out from watching it as in 2011, but I put that down to even more over-the-top matches happening since by guys like Omega and the Bucks, Ciampa and Gargano, etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by Diksting
    You can't have a reasonable discussion about serious topics with people like Marketh around.

  2. #122
    The Only 2x WC HOF
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    Re: ROH Revisited: A Totally Non-Corona Related Marketh Reviews Comeback

    I'll back you up on Edwards being quite good too. I don't remember the match much, I think I may have enjoyed it at the time but I have only seen it once before and that's when it aired. Given how my taste in wrestling has changed I don't think I'd enjoy it as much and I'm not in a rush to see it again.

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  3. #123
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    Re: ROH Revisited: A Totally Non-Corona Related Marketh Reviews Comeback

    Well since I dug up my old quote, let's see yours

    Quote Originally Posted by Shock View Post
    While not quite perfect, Eddie/Davey is the best match I've seen so far this year.
    Punk/Cena at MITB would happen about 3 weeks later, I'm guessing that stole your #1 MOTYC spot.

    Quote Originally Posted by Diksting
    You can't have a reasonable discussion about serious topics with people like Marketh around.

  4. #124
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    Re: ROH Revisited: A Totally Non-Corona Related Marketh Reviews Comeback

    Wow, I knew I liked it but that's some high praise. Might have to rewatch it at some point this weekend







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  5. #125
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    Re: ROH Revisited: A Totally Non-Corona Related Marketh Reviews Comeback

    Quote Originally Posted by Shock View Post
    Wow, I knew I liked it but that's some high praise. Might have to rewatch it at some point this weekend
    I expect your prediction of not liking it this time round will come true. The flaws are just more apparent after having been rewatching a bunch of greats.


    Bitter Friends, Stiffer Enemies 2
    Chicago Street Fight
    Kevin Steen & Steve Corino vs. El Generico & Colt Cabana



    https://www.bilibili.com/video/BV14W411M7Lz/

    It's part 2 of my Kevin Steen vs. El Generico revisit and we're tucking into the good shit now. Both teams cut promos immediately after Generico finally struck Steen at The Big Bang!, with Steen promising now that Generico has proven he has guts, Steen will rip them out and show them to everyone. Steve Corino's excellent fashion choice is a pure white dress shirt and trousers, because we all know what that promises.

    It's the traditional ROH plastic chairs crowd brawl to start with. It's the main event, so no issues tearing the building apart. These chairs have always looked as effective as dogshit unless they're taking them full-swing, unprotected to the head, which obviously no one's as eager to do anymore by this point. They do some neat spots to keep things interesting though, including unexpectedly taking out a security guy and Generico hitting his through-the-turnbuckles Tornado DDT, but actually through a scaffold. Steen and Generico have a precarious showdown on top of this scaffold, culminating in Steen hitting a Michinoku Driver on it. This takes Generico out so Steenorino can get the heat on Cabana. I like them minimising the Steen/Generico interactions so they can keep the anticipation going for their confrontations.

    The fun of this match is that it's sheer chaos, with the ringside and guardrails being destroyed and Corino's sick pleasure in torturing Cabana. It's only a few minutes in that Cabana's bleeding all over Corino's suit. I love this imagery. Generico sneaks in for the rescue to shove Steen off the top rope through some tables I didn't even realise were set up on the floor. He starts pummeling Corino with a chair, who grits his teeth and no-sells through them (he's an ECW guy and it's one of the plastic ones, I'll allow it) until Generico whacks him good and busts Corino open. The Steenerico interactions are mostly limited, this match is really focusing on Corino's comeuppance, taking an ass-kicking on Steen's behalf. Seriously, Corino's the oldest guy here and gets destroyed all throughout. This is nothing like a crazy filler brawl at all, it's hate-filled and brutal and doesn't get away from the story of this feud. Great moment with Generico against the corner, defiantly spitting in his former friend's face, only for Steen to break a chair over his head!

    It's a satisfying, merciless finish as Generico displays his new sadistic side. With Corino in Billy Goat's Curse, Generico slides a barbwire baseball bat under him and rubs Corino's face in it, before whacking the back of his head with a chair! Fatality. Too bad Kevin Kelly utterly undersold the devastation and viciousness of this moment. The lack of genuine enthusiasm was awful, I was just listening to "Jimmy Bower" jizzing himself over standard bumps in Joe/Punk II the other day, yet Kevin can't get it up for a nasty, bloody KO finish like this?! Generico's look says it all as he deathstares at Steen. What happened to Corino is a taste of what he wants to inflict on Steen, whose own fault it is that this side of Generico has been unleashed.

    It's not a classic or anything, but it's the wild and crazy brawl everyone wanted to see that previews a little bit more of Steen vs. Generico while still keeping plenty up their sleeves. It's the first big match and a milestone that either marks the end of the beginning or the beginning of the middle of this feud, depending on your perspective. Corino went all-out to show he's still got the ECW in him and how can you not love the white suit choice? I don't have a lot to say, really. Effective street fight that continued to bring the hate of this feud and escalated the violence. Just a lot of fun watching them tear the place apart in a messy battle. Plus the emphasis on the Corino/Cabana action helps expand this feud with the animosity between the supporting cast. They had a couple singles matches during this feud that went under the radar. So yeah, if you like entertaining, violent shit then this is a fun little match.

    Quote Originally Posted by Diksting
    You can't have a reasonable discussion about serious topics with people like Marketh around.

  6. #126
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    Re: ROH Revisited: A Totally Non-Corona Related Marketh Reviews Comeback

    Joe vs. Punk II
    'I Quit' Match
    Alex Shelley vs. Jimmy Jacobs




    https://www.bilibili.com/video/BV18s411w7iG/

    Time to redeem yourself, indyfan. That last Alex Shelley match was a dud, but I've heard good things before about this one.

    I'm pretty unfamiliar with this pre-Lacey stage of Jimmy Jacobs' career and why he's doing the Bezerker tribute or whatever. Commentary don't go into much detail on this feud, so apologies if any important story elements are lost on me. A lot of fun brawling on the floor and guardrail bumps, particularly a Shellshock into one. Shelley Skullfucks (the most appopriate name for this move) Jacobs on a chair, but it's a plastic one so doesn't look any more brutal than usual. Jacobs actually pulls out a railroad spike, which I'm either surprised he was using back then or this is his first use of it in ROH. It's him who actually takes the shot with it though and Shelley cuts his forehead with it. Shelley ducttapes him to the turnbuckle and a fan yells "Now would TNA ever do something like this?!" I mean, probably. They weren't exactly known for their lack of hardcore spots. So quit being a douche. Shelley has Jacobs trapped and uses the opportunity to take several whacks at him with a kendo stick. A lowblow gives Jacobs time to reach for a second spike from his boot and cut through the tape. I really liked that escape method, makes total sense for Jacobs and not simply convenient. I wish they played a bit more with him being stuck though, he didn't take that much damage for me to empathise with him and Shelley doesn't seem that dastardly.

    What is dastardly though is Shelley with a spike in one hand and kendo stick in the other, repeatedly hitting Jacobs in the head. Jacobs eventually fights out of a Border City Stretch with the fans hot on his side. Eventually, Shelley puts Jacobs' back through stacked chairs and gets him in the Border City Stretch once more for the "I Quit" at last. I was surprised it wasn't a babyface win, then I remember there's a bit of a gap between them as far as Shelley being the leader of Generation Next and Jacobs being a lowcarder with a bit of a comedy gimmick. This must've been a bit of a breakthrough for him, he came off great here. Shelley was decent too, but really this was all to put over Jacobs and elevate him. I'd say it worked, the crowd were very into him. Pretty interesting to see him before hardcore matches were his bread and butter. I enjoyed this as a fun, midcard, bloody brawl. I don't think it's spectacular, but I don't think they were trying to be anyway - just having an entertaining fight that shows Jacobs has some fight in him before falling to a better wrestler. I can think of a better I Quit match in Jacobs' career I definitely want to revisit down the line...

    Quote Originally Posted by Diksting
    You can't have a reasonable discussion about serious topics with people like Marketh around.

  7. #127
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    Re: ROH Revisited: A Totally Non-Corona Related Marketh Reviews Comeback

    glad you liked it. I dug this match bigtime. its been years since ive seen it. And yes this is jacobs first use of the spike. Its no where near the Aries match but at the time it showed how versatile Jacobs is.

    great idea by Gabe to have this right before Punk vs Joe as both matches are totally different.

    i still cant believe you think Punk vs Shelley is a dud. oh well..you re crazy
    Last edited by indyfan; 05-10-2020 at 10:07 AM.
    ROH 2003 - end of 2008 = best years of wrestling ever

  8. #128
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    Re: ROH Revisited: A Totally Non-Corona Related Marketh Reviews Comeback

    I remember this being pretty good. Shelley and Jacobs came up together and they had a series of matches in IWA:MS before this, but they were both pretty green at that point. Recall there being a cage match and a submissions match, but neither are as good as this one. Wasn't Jacobs still doing his mini-Beserker gimmick at this point? That God he discovered he was good at hardcore wrestling.

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    Re: ROH Revisited: A Totally Non-Corona Related Marketh Reviews Comeback

    Yeah he was still mini beserker. it was such an annoying gimmick
    ROH 2003 - end of 2008 = best years of wrestling ever

  10. #130
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    Re: ROH Revisited: A Totally Non-Corona Related Marketh Reviews Comeback

    Best In The World 2014
    ROH World Championship
    Adam Cole vs. Michael Elgin




    https://www.bilibili.com/video/BV1Rx411b7bW

    In the hype package, Michael Elgin says "I don't wanna be known as a good wrestler who was once in Ring of Honor and might come up in conversation, I wanna be known as the greatest Ring of Honor champ in history." Boy, did that work out...

    Elgin's brief and messily-concluded title reign was especially frustrating after experiencing yet another overly long chase that went well past the point of his peak popularity. Attempts to rebuild his overness always felt forced and lacked authenticity. This is one of those chases where most of the joy at the win is just at the fact that this angle is finally over and maybe actually being a dominant champ could freshen Elgin up. In hindsight (and I probably felt this way at the time too), they should have just phased Elgin out of the title picture for a bit and embraced someone like Tommaso Ciampa, but with all the time put into Elgin, they were going to see this through to the bitter end. The final attempt to build heat for challenging Adam Cole was for The Kingdom to tie Elgin up and shave his famous mullet, while that dastardly Cole put MsChif, Elgin's wife, in the Figure Four. Low even for his standards. So that's lit a bit of a fire on the go-home show, but really they've had almost a year since Cole beat Elgin for the vacant belt in the tournament finals to make this feud personal. I can barely remember anything that's happened between them during that time. I cannot remember any exciting storytelling whatsoever, just matches and swapping wins. Well, now the heel's humiliated the babyface and assaulted the love of his life, so this match should be filled with plenty heat and hatred to give Elgin's long hunt the satisfying payoff it needs.

    I remember thinking how weird shaved head Elgin looked, seeing it for the first time. Cole gets streamers in his entrance and Elgin didn't. This is not a good sign for our new babyface champ. I can't speak much for NXT Cole, but I bloody loved him as a top heel in this reign. I enjoyed his charisma, his promos, his shit-eating grin and I thought he worked well as a sports entertainment type champion while still delivering enough good wrestling. He came into the role very comfortably, I think he was already doing this in PWG. Problem is he's so charismatic and fun to watch and Elgin is so bland and serious, it's hard to root for Elgin. They also don't write Cole to be enough of a piece of shit to be legit booed. He Superkicked Jay Briscoe after he relinquished the belt to Cole and he attacked Elgin's wife. Those are the two most unlikeable things I can think of that he did in this time, the rest is just standard being a dick and cheating to win matches. Cole was a great performer with what he was given, but got hardly any true, memorable, diabolical, heel angles to work with. Some referees are keeping Elgin back from Cole, which is a nice touch. Cole mocks Elgin that he's in his head, but Elgin abides by the Code of Honor to show he's wrong. This changes Cole's demeanour and I like what they're doing so far.

    This doesn't mean Elgin's not bringing the fight though, the first minute is him aggressively laying into Cole. Cole manages to find a chance to go for a plancha, but Elgin does a Samoa Joe and Cole takes a flat bump on the floor that had to suck. He drops Cole hard on the entrance ramp and I'm into this so far. But once they're back in the ring, it just feels like them doing moves and the crowd isn't consistently with them. There's some sporadic chanting, but still plenty of spots that get only little or brief pops. Elgin's deadlift top rope Falcon Arrow is just another mid-match move and gets a "That Was Awesome!" chant, then back to silence again. Around this point, it starts to feel like they're already in the finishing sequence despite no real heat section - doing big moves like a Reverse Hurricanrana and a Florida Key kickout, so we're already tucking into the finishers. The crowd chants "That Was Awesome" again, so good that they're enjoying it, but doesn't exactly feel earned. The tension from the start hasn't lasted, I'm just watching them do moves without structure.

    The crowd erupts for Todd Sinclair eating a Superkick outta nowhere and Elgin gets his Bucklebomb/Elgin Bomb combo for the non-existent 3-count. Can't believe we're already at this point when it feels like barely anything has actually happened yet. Matt Hardy and Mike Bennett interfere, but Elgin takes care of them easily. He even Powerbombs Cole onto them on the outside. Whenever Elgin gets to be a badass, it's always over, so it's just a shame he's not charismatic enough to simply carry himself as one all the time. But he can't bring himself to hit Maria, which leads to The Kingdom killing him on the floor. See, when it comes to heel valets nowadays, I absolutely think it's justified for a babyface to hit them in the heat of the moment. It took Maria slapping Elgin before he went to chase her, but the fact he didn't hit her without hesitation like he would for a man, just screams old school white meat babyface to me. Maria had a role in Cole assaulting his wife, being a gentleman is out the window. Do you care about chivalry more than the championship? War Machine come to the rescue and it's a minor clusterfuck, the crowd's into it, but feels totally like everything before this was them filling time to get to here. We get the classic, overused since Adam Pearce introduced it, countout tease. Not many occasions where I've bought into it.

    In an actual nice bit of story continuity, MsChif shows up with the Green Mist when Maria tries to interfere again. Elgin hits his finishing combo again but only a 2-count! Someone gets worked so hard they throw a streamer too early, so a bunch of other fans throw them in for fun. Whatever the reason, it's a pretty cool moment and really the only thing I remembered from this match. Hilarious "We Fucked Up!" chant. I'm not a fan of Cole's selling after this, he's taken Elgin's finish twice and doesn't seem that weakened once he's up and now working Elgin's leg. Elgin tries to run and his leg collapses, but it feels like a bit much for what's only been about a minute of legwork. Seems odd we're doing this now and not earlier after Cole working it for longer. After a couple more nearfalls, including Elgin taking a Panama Destroyer, they re-enact The Hulk and Loki with Elgin just Powerbombing the shit out of Cole multiple times before getting the third and final Elgin Bomb for the decisive victory.

    Fuckload of streamers and ROH have splashed out on confetti to WrestleMania the shit out of this moment. The best part is Cole on the outside, crying and covered in streamers. It's a great, satisfying visual for a dickhead heel losing his gold. We get loud chants for ROH, everyone's on their feet and cheering for Elgin. It's the ideal outcome for ROH. But it's hardly a great match and with the amount of interference and it doesn't feel like they have much faith in their top guys to just go out there and have a great match and tell a great story on their own, without all the extras and skipping to the third act. I'll admit to enjoying some parts of the finishing sequence, but they thankfully had the crowd on their side for everything once the ref got Superkicked. A lot of it felt like safe, easy pops that were always gonna get over, though. Apart from their interactions during the introductions and Code of Honor, then MsChif getting some revenge on Maria, this never felt like a deep, personal feud at all and lacked attempts to tell this story. I've been watching Punk and Joe tell a more heated story out of "Punk wants to beat Joe" than what we got here from a year-long feud. The ending was clearly satisfying to the live crowd, so it's a success in that respect, but really doesn't feel special to me. Elgin's reaction, Cole's moping while covered in streamers, the fans marking out, the confetti - it's a great win for ROH, but isn't deserved.

    Quote Originally Posted by Diksting
    You can't have a reasonable discussion about serious topics with people like Marketh around.

  11. #131
    Curtain Jerker

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    Re: ROH Revisited: A Totally Non-Corona Related Marketh Reviews Comeback

    How about hitting some famous matches from 2003:
    Epic Encounter - Bryan Danielson vs. Paul London 2/3 Fall match (April 2003)
    Danielson vs. AJ Styles - Main Even Spectacles
    AJ/Amazing Red vs. Briscoes
    Samoa Joe vs. Homicide - Do Or Die
    CM Punk vs. Raven - Death Before Dishonor

    I just finished the Epic Encounter and it's EARLY Danielson but it's good. Not amazing, but good. I wrote a review of it in my thread in General Wrestling Discussion area.

  12. #132
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    Re: ROH Revisited: A Totally Non-Corona Related Marketh Reviews Comeback

    Thanks, I needed some 2003 recommendations. What's your favourite of those? I'll make it the next request.

    Quote Originally Posted by Diksting
    You can't have a reasonable discussion about serious topics with people like Marketh around.

  13. #133
    Curtain Jerker

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    Re: ROH Revisited: A Totally Non-Corona Related Marketh Reviews Comeback

    Quote Originally Posted by Marketh View Post
    Thanks, I needed some 2003 recommendations. What's your favourite of those? I'll make it the next request.
    My memory is hazy and I haven't seen most of them in a long long time (only just rewatched Danielson/London).

    I'd probably suggest these two (very different matches) depending on the style you like:

    Brawler:
    Steve Corino vs. Homicide - Bitter Friends Stiffer Enemies

    Technical:
    Bryan Danielson vs. Aj Styles - Main Event Spectacles

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    Re: ROH Revisited: A Totally Non-Corona Related Marketh Reviews Comeback

    Heres a few i really loved from 2003

    1) London vs Lowki vs Aj styles from One Year Anniversary
    2) Jody Fleish vs Lowki from Night of Champions
    3) Aj styles vs Paul London from Night of the Grudges
    4) Bryan Danielson vs Aj Styles from Main Event Spectacles
    5) Carnage Crew vs TWA from Death Before Dishonor
    6) AJ Styles and Amazing Red vs The Briscoes from Night of Grudges
    7) Samoa Joe vs Aj styles from War of the Wire


    heres some more from my.notes

    Trent Acid vs Homicide from Wrestlerave
    Samoa Joe vs Bryan Danielson - Revenge of the Prophecy and 1 Year Anniversary
    Kaz Hayashi vs AJ Styles from Final Battle 2003
    ROH 2003 - end of 2008 = best years of wrestling ever

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    Re: ROH Revisited: A Totally Non-Corona Related Marketh Reviews Comeback

    Death Before Dishonor VIII
    El Generico vs. Kevin Steen




    https://www.bilibili.com/video/BV14W411M7Lz

    Part 3 of my Steenerico feud revisit brings us to Death Before Dishonor VIII, a show which when I remind myself of the card, could likely have been one of the best shows of the iPPV era - depending on your opinion whether the Davey/Tyler main event is a classic or an abortion. It has one of my favourite Briscoes brawls against KOW, solid midcard matches with ANX/Cheech & Cloudy, Aries/Delirious and a very good Omega/Daniels match. The #1 contender's gauntlet dragged, but no show is perfect. And of course, it opens with the highly-anticipated first singles encounter between Kevin Steen and El Generico. So this show had quite a bit going for it.

    Always loved how this kicks off with Generico storming out and screaming "Steen! NOW!" Steve Corino is out to tease them holding this back because Steen should only wrestle in the main event and has a nice line about his black suit being for Generico's funeral. But Steen wants this fight too, so bolts to the ring (despite Corino's begging) to go face-to-face with Generico while the crowd is losing their shit. It's a fearless and determined Generico, kicking Steen's ass for the first few minutes to "Ole!" chants. Steen takes control with his Backbreaker counter to the Tornado DDT, which I've always loved as a move but especially the way skinny Generico takes it. Steen is such an enjoyable heel to watch in these matches, he's good at showing the sheer manic joy he gets from hurting Generico, then reverting to a coward when he gets his comeuppance. Generico hits his Tornado DDT dive through the bottom turnbuckle and I know we've had years to get used to this, but how fucking awesome is that move? The imagination to come up with it and the balls to execute. I'd be worried I'd just slam head-first into the turnbuckle attempting it, but I've never seen Generico botch it and it always looks great.

    They've built the anticipation to this match so well that any offence Generico gets feels important. Interesting spot I forgot, where he puts Steen in the Sharpshooter (cause it was a finish of Steen's back then, not just because this is in Canada) and it's not just a typical finisher theft, but works as Generico not being content with a normal victory, he needs to hurt Steen's pride and force him to surrender to someone he views as weaker than him. But Steen gets to the ropes, then we have a struggle for the next big move and Generico gets a chance at a Brainbuster. But surprise, motherfucka! It's Steen lifting him up for one - it would seem - but he drops Generico into position for a Package Piledriver and nails it for a nearfall! Awesome sequence, awesome execution you would never have seen coming on the first viewing. This was probably also the first Package Piledriver kickout for at least the 6 months since this feud started. After going to town with Ole Kicks, Generico attempts a Brainbustah! but Steen sneaks in a shot from a pipe or wrench or something metal out of the turnbuckle, then wins with an avalanche Pumphandle Neckbreaker. I've never been blown away by the finish, but it's fine enough. If it were me, I would've wanted to tie it in more to their story with a chairshot to the head instead of that inanimate carbon rod or whatever that was. But what we got served its purpose.

    So yeah, I love this match. It perfectly succeeds as Steenerico's first singles match and the fact they lasted 6 months before pulling the trigger without losing steam, then still left plenty room for more? Brilliant. Generico isn't dead, but was shown to be a formidable foe for the next time they face one-on-one. The only negative experiences I had in this had nothing at all to do with Steenerico - there's a fangirl I totally forgot existed who, for a few Toronto shows, had the most obnoxious, dragged-out, loud, high-pitched screams and solo chanting. She's not at her worst here, but her presence brought back cringeworthy memories. And the commentary was badly recorded with scratchy audio at times. Just cut that out for the DVD, for fuck's sake. A silent pause is better than including that in your presentation. They had the crowd on their side for all of this, they didn't overstay their welcome and the action was very entertaining. You leave this with a feeling that if this is them holding back, then when they up the ante it's going to be special.

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    Re: ROH Revisited: A Totally Non-Corona Related Marketh Reviews Comeback

    I'm not sure I'm going to have the time to re-visit these, but from memory this one was great. I'd maybe rate it as good if not better than the Ladder match.

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    Re: ROH Revisited: A Totally Non-Corona Related Marketh Reviews Comeback

    Quote Originally Posted by King Steventon View Post
    I'm not sure I'm going to have the time to re-visit these, but from memory this one was great. I'd maybe rate it as good if not better than the Ladder match.
    I don’t think I’d be too into the ladder war if I revisited it. I remember it being less story-driven and blatant setting up for ladder bumps, never really dug that double ladder bridge finish. Just felt like they did it for the cool visual. Hopefully I'm wrong, but I'm just gonna stick to the 2010 feud.

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    Re: ROH Revisited: A Totally Non-Corona Related Marketh Reviews Comeback

    Bitter Friends, Stiffer Enemies
    No Holds Barred Match
    Homicide vs. Steve Corino




    https://www.bilibili.com/video/BV11t411u7oD

    Been looking forward to this since it was suggested. It's been so long since I've seen this that all I really remember is Homicide rupturing Steve Corino's eardrum with a slap, but I know that I dug this quite a bit. Corino's entrance is glorious, accompanied by his "young boy" students, covered in title belts, with the rave music that I think is due a comeback to entrances nowadays. I completely forgot Bobby Cruise started off as his personal ring announcer and the obnoxiously long intro, rattling off every single championship and nickname, is genius heel work. David Starr has to have been influenced by this. Cruise even pauses for a drink of water. It almost seems out-of-character for Homicide not to interrupt all of this. It's too good of an entrance for the smark crowd not to cheer it by the end.

    "This is one of the most intense collar-and-elbow lockups I've ever seen!", exclaims Jimmy Bower after they've barely touched yet. Some good, heated striking culminates in the infamous slap that is "the kind of slap that could disable Corino forever!" Well, this time Bower's not exaggerating since Homicide's right hand was the last thing Corino ever heard in that ear. That pretty much sounded like a Kobashi chop. Kudos for continuing with that kind of injury, it had to be really distracting the rest of the match. It's just a dirty fight between them that escalates with the sociopathic Homicide cutting Corino's arm with barbed wire. They're hanging over the guard rail which, if I was sitting in the front row, would be freaking me out with the chance of Corino bleeding all over me. He makes a comeback after a Lariat though, and returns the favour by busting Homicide open too. Homicide's bleeding from his head and much more blood than Corino. He's especially dazed after a Piledriver through a table and leaves a disgusting puddle on the floor.

    Homicide almost makes a comeback until Corino dodges a tope con hilo, Homicide crashing with zero control into the guard rail and landing in the front row! Fucking sick bump. I'd like to imagine it was supposed to connect and this is Corino's receipt for the burst eardrum, but it's probably unlikely. What I like about this brawl is there's hardly any wasted action. They're always doing little things inbetween to punish each other, like after this spot, Corino pulls Homicide back into the ring by his ears. They work this like it's a fight to the death, so it's full of dirty tactics and disrespect because there's no use for honour here. Homicide is crazy over in this too, his face as a crimson mask and struggle show he's more vulnerable than you'd normally see him, so you can't help but rally behind him. I do wish the managers disappeared though, Julius Smokes (who I've never minded) is particularly distracting and taking away some of the seriousness with his shenanigans. If the crowd's already hyped for Homicide, that should be his cue to rein it in because he's unnecessary.

    After a bunch of nearfalls, eventually the towel gets thrown in when Corino's trapped in a long submission attempt. This was great. It's a nasty, violent brawl between a huge asshole and an unhinged thug, filled with believable hatred and unpredictability. It's almost uncomfortable to cheer for Homicide, since he fights as dirty as Corino, but when he's down and bloody and 100% of the crowd is behind him, it's hard not to not get sucked in. It was just so gritty and real. Sure, there's wrestling bumps but this is completely stripped of any spectacle, crowd pandering, showmanship, routine spots or formulaic storytelling. They're such different personalities and styles that it's easy to buy them not getting along in real life. Plus, the towel throw finish suits the sports style ROH was going for, even if it's the opposite of a technical classic. Surely ranks high in ROH's best brawls.

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    Re: ROH Revisited: A Totally Non-Corona Related Marketh Reviews Comeback

    Excellent match from memory and glad you think it holds up. Cool to see Homicide getting revisited after he got stomped in the tournament, I thin people have started to forget how great he was during his prime. I mean I like Corino more than most, but Homicide getting this level of a match out of him in 2003 is something. The barbwire ring match is also great as well.

    Give us a Jimmy Rave revisit soon!

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    Re: ROH Revisited: A Totally Non-Corona Related Marketh Reviews Comeback

    Quote Originally Posted by King Steventon View Post
    Excellent match from memory and glad you think it holds up. Cool to see Homicide getting revisited after he got stomped in the tournament, I thin people have started to forget how great he was during his prime. I mean I like Corino more than most, but Homicide getting this level of a match out of him in 2003 is something. The barbwire ring match is also great as well.

    Give us a Jimmy Rave revisit soon!
    Jimmy Rave is so underrated .

    Theres plenty of good matches too

    Rave vs Styles from 3rd anniversary show night 2

    Rave vs Punk from Manhantan Mayhem and Nowhere to Run

    Rave Vs Mcguiness from Chicago Night Spectacular night 1, Final Battle 2006 and 5th year festival : Finale

    Rave vs Davey Richards from Unified
    ROH 2003 - end of 2008 = best years of wrestling ever

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