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Thread: Best Workers of the Late 2010s Project - RESULTS COUNTDOWN!

  1. #141
    King EC

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    Re: Best Workers of the Late 2010s Project - RESULTS COUNTDOWN!

    What a fucking upset!
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    Re: Best Workers of the Late 2010s Project - RESULTS COUNTDOWN!

    Ishii/Shibata ruined NJPW because the consistent quality of the product would never match their style and that was the first thing I'd ever watched. Anyways, Ishii is the fucking man and its tragic that he doesnt look like an Okada because he deserves a lot better than he's ever been treated.

    Todd Chavez: I'm deeply sad and nothing can make me happy.

    Also, eat the rich.

  3. #143
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    Re: Best Workers of the Late 2010s Project - RESULTS COUNTDOWN!

    10 points separating the top 4. That is absurdly close. Any single voter could have decided the final result.

    Props to Steve for organising and everyone else for the threads. It's been a blast. Surprised to see Ishii win but the voters have spoken.







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  4. #144
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    Re: Best Workers of the Late 2010s Project - RESULTS COUNTDOWN!

    I couldn't recall the order I put them in, but funny to see I had the top 4 as my top 4 but in reverse order. 10 points separating 4th from 1st really is something.

    I quickly settled on Walter as my working #1 and never got tempted to switch that up. I think for 2 years he was definitely the wrestler of the year, and there was enough work in 2019 on a limited schedule that made him a contender for it last year too. So many wrestlers have Walter to think for the career they have now (Thatcher included) because he knows how to get people over and put promotions on the map. I don't expect his WWE career to pan out and I think he'll be back on the indies in a couple of years to have more shots at being the WOTY again. I know indyfan didn't put him on the list, but I'm putting the blame here on Jon Snow for Walter not getting the crown, boo that man.

    I was a late comer to Thatcher, but I also think he did really improve with his personality and fan connection during 2017, to the point now where he's an excellent babyface wrestler with so much fire and spirit and love for wrestling and everyone seems to respect the dude these days.

    AJ was fantastic for 2 and a bit years in a number of companies, then I think for another year and change he was getting the best out of the opportunities WWE was putting him into with less than great talents, and then in 2019 he just hit a wall where there's very little of his work I enjoyed. It's weird even though I put AJ over Ishii by one position, the more I think about it, I'd rather Ishii win this than AJ.

    Ishii has been mr consistency throughout the last 5 years, no-one in Japan has been better than he's been. There's not one singles match of his I can point to and say 'well that was disappointing', he always delivers, even when they make him wrestle fucking Taichi. The Okada matches, the tanahashi matches, the naito matches, the honma matches, the array of NEVER title matches with Goto and Shibata, the Moxley match, all great matches. The only reason he was #2 for me is I felt the 3 above him all offered more variety of performance and there's times where they've grabbed me emotionally in ways Ishii hasn't recently. I'm not sure that's really a big knock against Ishii because he's never needed to change his game up and it's not his fault NJPW won't push him any harder than he is.

    Steve even though only a few of us contributed lists, this was still one of my favourite things I've been apart of on the forum. Thanks for running it.

  5. #145
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    Re: Best Workers of the Late 2010s Project - RESULTS COUNTDOWN!

    Steve job well done, this was one of my favourite things to be apart of. The top 4 is great and delighted to see Ishii pull off the upset


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  6. #146
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    Re: Best Workers of the Late 2010s Project - RESULTS COUNTDOWN!

    Haven't watched nearly enough to participate, but have read and followed the process throughout, great work everyone, especially Steve for running it

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  7. #147
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    Re: Best Workers of the Late 2010s Project - RESULTS COUNTDOWN!

    I'm not really sure why I put AJ that high tbh. Maybe his name value got into my mind because I definitely don't think he was that good

    Ishii can have his dreadfully dull matches but he's usually good. Good enough for me not to think he shouldn't be #1

  8. #148
    King EC

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    Re: Best Workers of the Late 2010s Project - RESULTS COUNTDOWN!

    Ranked too low:

    Seth Rollins - Given who submitted lists, I can’t be that surprised. That’s not throwing shade or anything. I just know you guys and I know Rollins is someone who gets more hate than love among this crowd. Still, to be the only person who put him in their top 50 is pretty damn shocking. I was hoping indyfan at least would help me out. I honestly think it’s kinda nuts he ended up being the lowest ranking SHIELD guy.

    Adam Cole - Basically the same as Seth Rollins, although I am not nearly as bothered by his low rank.

    Jay Lethal - Basically the same as Adam Cole.

    Taiji Ishimori - Eh. This one’s iffy. But again, I was the only person that voted for him. I feel he could have placed at least 10 spots higher.

    YAMATO - Sorta like Ishimori, I think he could have been 10 or more spots higher than where he landed, especially considering who all landed in front of him. But I didn’t put him on my list either so I can’t bitch too much about that. Shout out to MC 16 though for helping him not miss out entirely.

    DIY - Unlike The New Day, The Usos, The Bucks and (for the most part) The Briscoes, who I will get to later, both of these guys have some scorchers in their singles catalogue to go right along with some of the best tag team matches over this five year period. As much as I hate the character than Gargano has turned into, and as much as I think his Cole matches are overrated by the general public… he still has stuff like the Ciampa series, the Andrade series, the Ricochet match, the Black match and Halftime Heat. They should have both been higher imo.

    Tetsuya Naito - I honestly don’t even understand how he landed so low.

    Kenny Omega - I understand how he landed so low but I don’t agree with it.

    Brock Lesnar - I had him at #7, so yeah. I obviously consider him one of the very best workers of this period and I would almost certainly say he would have been my top pick, or at least top 3, if he just wrestled more often and didn’t completely phone in the matches with Braun and Roman.

    Ranked too high:

    The Usos, Big E and Xavier Woods (maybe Kofi?) - Yeah, I’m not seeing it. The New Day and The Usos are two of the top three tag teams in WWE over this stretch (as long as you don’t count NXT). Sure. But I just don’t think there’s nearly enough evidence of Big E, Xavier, Jimmy and Jey in singles action for me to comprehend them being in someone’s top 50. I had The Bucks, Usos and New Day on my list at one point, until I realized we had to list them individually, and then I couldn’t see putting them on there in that fashion because I just don’t feel that confident saying that they are great workers on their own. Maybe I’m being dismissive of tag teams or not giving enough credit but yeah. If nothing else, it’s absurd that Big E and both Usos are ranked higher than the likes of Seth Rollins, Pentagon, Jordan Devlin and RUSH, among others.

    Sami Callihan - This is probably a weird one coming from me because I am a huge Sami Callihan fan, but I just don’t think he’s particularly special as far as being a worker goes. Barring a couple of exceptions, if the match isn’t a car crash or he isn’t fighting a woman, his matches really don’t move the needle for me.

    Roman Reigns - Like I said earlier in the thread, it’s not so much that I think he isn’t a good worker because I do believe he is. We’ve seen him be a really good worker. But it’s hard for me to ignore the complete duds he’s had, including three of the worst WrestleMania main events of all time and that awful stretch of PPV matches between Backlash and SummerSlam 2018, just because he did have some great matches against AJ Styles and over delivered in the Braun feud. Huge caveat again though because WWE have set him up to fail more often than anyone else in the company... but... it is what it is. I could see him being in the 40-50 range, but 30 is too high for me.

    --------------------------------------


    All in all I know lists like these are super volatile, especially when there’s only 9 ballots being sent in. Things can be swung pretty significantly with just one ballot. I have no major gripes really, just thought I’d go over what I thought of the whole list.


    Thanks for the work put in to this Steve. I’m definitely looking forward to the next edition of this, whenever that is.
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  9. #149
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    Re: Best Workers of the Late 2010s Project - RESULTS COUNTDOWN!

    This was a lot of fun despite the graft involved.

    I was surprised at Ishii being #1, but it's not a huge upset considering the majority of people who watch NJ consider him to be an elite level guy. It was very close though. I stand by WALTER as my #1 even with nothing going on in '15-'17. That list of recommended matches is not only extensive, but look at some of the guys he's working with there. No one else has gotten more out of less.

    It is fun to see how some of our opinions changed on guys as we went though the year. I was iffy on a few guys and ended up going really high on them. I still think Zack was more very good than great for most of his bug run and had some stuff I disliked, but looking at the list of matches to his name there really was too much for me to not go high.

    There are some guys I would have liked to see higher (and some lower) but I can safely say none of you guys have terrible opinions.








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  10. #150
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    Re: Best Workers of the Late 2010s Project - RESULTS COUNTDOWN!

    Full rankings:

    Spoiler:


    #101 Mark Briscoe
    #100 Gentleman Jack Gallagher
    #99 Matt Jackson
    #98 Daniel Makabe
    #97 Sami Zayn
    #96 Low Ki
    #95 Becky Lynch
    #94 Eddie Kingston
    #93 Adam Cole
    #92 Taiji Ishimori
    #91 Shayna Baszler
    #90 Badndido
    #89 Tsukasa Fujimoto
    #88 Chris Jericho
    #87 Shigehiro Irie
    #86 LA PARK
    #85 Jun Akiyama
    #84 Jay Lethal
    #83 Nick Jackson
    #82 Xavier Woods
    #81 Jay Briscoe
    #80 Sasha Banks
    #79 Kohei Sato
    #78 Speedball Mike Bailey
    #77 Daisuke Harada
    #76 Hechicero
    #75 Atsushi Kotoge
    #74 Bayley
    #73 Seth Rollins
    #72 Pentagon Jr.
    #71 Jordan Devlin
    #70 Rush
    #69 Charlotte Flair
    #68 Jey Uso
    #67 YAMATO
    #66 Jimmy Uso
    #65 Cameron Grimes
    #64 HARASHIMA
    #63 Big E
    #62 Kofi Kingston
    #61 Fred Yehi
    #60 Aleister Blacker
    #59 Kevin Owens
    #58 Takuya Nomura
    #57 Arisa Nakajima
    #56 Sami Callihan
    #55 Hotsauce Tracy Williams
    #54 Go Shiozaki
    #53 Masaaki Mochizuki
    #52 Konosuke Takeshita
    #51 Keith Lee
    #50 Oney Lorcan
    #49 Jon Moxley
    #48 Ricochet
    #47 Johnny Gargano
    #46 Katsuyori Shibata
    #45 Tommaso Ciampa
    #44 Kairi Sane
    #43 Pete Dunne
    #42 Mayu Iwatani
    #41 Hideki Suzuki
    #40 Ilja Dragunov
    #39 Barbaro Cavernario
    #38 Tetsuya Naito
    #37 Darby Allin
    #36 Hirooki Goto
    #35 Kenny Omega
    #34 Yuji Okanayashi
    #33 Kushida
    #32 Shuji Ishikawa
    #31 Meiko Satomura
    #30 Roman Reigns
    #29 Kyle O'Reilly
    #28 Cesaro
    #27 Hiromu Takahashi
    #26 Andrade
    #25 Asuka
    #24 Kento Miyahara
    #23 Fenix
    #22 Daisuke Sekimoto
    #21 Shingo Takagi
    #20 Brock Lesnar
    #19 Io Shirari
    #18 Drew Gulak
    #17 David Starr
    #16 Jonathan Gresham
    #15 Tyler Bate
    #14 Dragon Lee
    #13 Kazuchika Okada
    #12 Daniel Bryan
    #11 Hiroshi Tanahashi
    #10 Kassius Ohno
    #9 Will Ospreay
    #8 Roderick Strong
    #7 Kota Ibushi
    #6 Matt Riddle
    #5 Zack Sabre Jr.
    #4 WALTER
    #3 Timothy Thatcher
    #2 AJ Styles
    #1 Tomohiro Ishii

  11. #151
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    Re: Best Workers of the Late 2010s Project - RESULTS COUNTDOWN!

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Peanutbutter View Post
    Ranked too low:

    Seth Rollins - Given who submitted lists, I can’t be that surprised. That’s not throwing shade or anything. I just know you guys and I know Rollins is someone who gets more hate than love among this crowd. Still, to be the only person who put him in their top 50 is pretty damn shocking. I was hoping indyfan at least would help me out. I honestly think it’s kinda nuts he ended up being the lowest ranking SHIELD guy.
    I don't think there's anything controversial about Rollins being the lowest ranked Shield member when Moxley's gone on to show how versatile he can be outside of WWE and how much of a popular babyface he is, and Roman gets a lot out of bad opponents. Seth's had two of the worst world title runs of all time, seems to fail every time he's pushed, and had a lengthy spell out injured. Seth pretty much needs to be in there with a great wrestler to have a great match.

    Jay Lethal - Basically the same as Adam Cole.
    I think he was probably underrated because he was great for ROH. I just never watched them regularly enough to find room for him.

    DIY - Unlike The New Day, The Usos, The Bucks and (for the most part) The Briscoes, who I will get to later, both of these guys have some scorchers in their singles catalogue to go right along with some of the best tag team matches over this five year period. As much as I hate the character than Gargano has turned into, and as much as I think his Cole matches are overrated by the general public… he still has stuff like the Ciampa series, the Andrade series, the Ricochet match, the Black match and Halftime Heat. They should have both been higher imo.
    I think there's definitely a case for them to be higher, but that 2018 feud really soured people on them and I know personally I cannot watch Gargano anymore the same way I used to.

    Tetsuya Naito - I honestly don’t even understand how he landed so low.
    Because he's a formulaic wrestler, the weakest of the NJ main eventers, and Gedo killed a lot of support for him by sacrificing him to Okada in 2018.

    Kenny Omega - I understand how he landed so low but I don’t agree with it.
    Eh looking at his 5 years as a whole, I think he's lucky to finish where he did.

    Brock Lesnar - I had him at #7, so yeah. I obviously consider him one of the very best workers of this period and I would almost certainly say he would have been my top pick, or at least top 3, if he just wrestled more often and didn’t completely phone in the matches with Braun and Roman.
    It's a double edged sword, I didn't rate him any higher because he didn't wrestle enough, but if he wrestled more often with the exact same style I think it would get very old and wouldn't have the same impact it does now.

    Ranked too high:

    The Usos, Big E and Xavier Woods (maybe Kofi?) - Yeah, I’m not seeing it. The New Day and The Usos are two of the top three tag teams in WWE over this stretch (as long as you don’t count NXT). Sure. But I just don’t think there’s nearly enough evidence of Big E, Xavier, Jimmy and Jey in singles action for me to comprehend them being in someone’s top 50. I had The Bucks, Usos and New Day on my list at one point, until I realized we had to list them individually, and then I couldn’t see putting them on there in that fashion because I just don’t feel that confident saying that they are great workers on their own. Maybe I’m being dismissive of tag teams or not giving enough credit but yeah. If nothing else, it’s absurd that Big E and both Usos are ranked higher than the likes of Seth Rollins, Pentagon, Jordan Devlin and RUSH, among others.
    I don't think they finished ridiculously too high. If like you say they are the best teams in their respective fields then there's not much more they can do with the opportunities they were allowed. No-ones sitting here saying well AJ Styles doesn't have any great tag team matches to his name, so why is it such a slight against New Day and Usos that they don't have a great singles match.

    Sami Callihan - This is probably a weird one coming from me because I am a huge Sami Callihan fan, but I just don’t think he’s particularly special as far as being a worker goes. Barring a couple of exceptions, if the match isn’t a car crash or he isn’t fighting a woman, his matches really don’t move the needle for me.
    He's found a home in Impact that suits him, but my god there was some trash we had to put up with on the indies from Sami.

    Roman Reigns - Like I said earlier in the thread, it’s not so much that I think he isn’t a good worker because I do believe he is. We’ve seen him be a really good worker. But it’s hard for me to ignore the complete duds he’s had, including three of the worst WrestleMania main events of all time and that awful stretch of PPV matches between Backlash and SummerSlam 2018, just because he did have some great matches against AJ Styles and over delivered in the Braun feud. Huge caveat again though because WWE have set him up to fail more often than anyone else in the company... but... it is what it is. I could see him being in the 40-50 range, but 30 is too high for me.
    I think 30 is quite a solid placing for Roman. Solid wrestler who on his day can put on something great but the output isn't really there to be a top 20 guy. I'd disagree with anyone who had him top 10.

  12. #152
    King EC

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    Re: Best Workers of the Late 2010s Project - RESULTS COUNTDOWN!

    Quote Originally Posted by Ed View Post
    I don't think there's anything controversial about Rollins being the lowest ranked Shield member when Moxley's gone on to show how versatile he can be outside of WWE and how much of a popular babyface he is, and Roman gets a lot out of bad opponents. Seth's had two of the worst world title runs of all time, seems to fail every time he's pushed, and had a lengthy spell out injured. Seth pretty much needs to be in there with a great wrestler to have a great match.
    I truly think Reigns and Moxley have longer runs of being unspectacular than Rollins does. I also don't know which two world title runs you consider among the WOAT. The most recent Universal Title run would be up there for me among the worst but it has little to do with his work and more to do with feuding with The Fiend and some of the worst booking we've ever seen. Nonetheless, I didn't expect Rollins to be the top SHIELD guy (although he was my top SHIELD guy), I just figured he'd beat out one of the other guys. Moxley, most likely. Until 8 months ago most people had pretty much given given up on him as a wrestler.

    Regarding The Usos and New Day - The answer is pretty simple I guess. Singles wrestling is just more important, in my view. So I put more stock in someone who can wrestle a great singles match than I do someone who can wrestle a great tag match.

    Interestingly they were ranked ahead of Rollins and Pentagon who are two guys who excel in both categories. Which, really is what my main gripe is.
    Last edited by Mr. Peanutbutter; 01-25-2020 at 06:33 PM.
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