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Thread: Premier League 2019/2020 Discussion Thread

  1. #441
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    Re: Premier League 2019/2020 Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Chaddes View Post
    Tbh, while Ozil wasn't the best today, I think it's kind of Pepe's fault as well. During the first half you see Ozil on the wing a lot, moving from the centre to the right, but Pepe, instead of moving up the pitch to help in the centre, stays on the right with Ozil. There was clearly some miscommunication there.

    Also, on Mustafi, I'd argue that it doesn't matter how "skilled" a defender you are if the team are consistently losing and conceding goals specifically because of your mistakes. I remember Mustafi having a decent period in the Europa League at the beginning of the season, and having a fine game against Sheffield, that's it. every game I've seen him play he's made some sort of stupid gaff or just not bothered to challenge. I see him staying until the end of his contract tbh, simply because, who's gonna buy him? He's being paid good money and with how easy it is to clip up his mistakes, no one is going to want to buy him. He may have the lowest reputation out of any defender in the big 6 clubs, other than Phil Jones.
    We don't have a fully functioning system yet. There are many problems. Pepe doesn't do enough defensively. Neither does Ozil.

    I pretty much agree, but the fact that he can go several matches and be solidly reliable is why he keeps getting chances with manager after manager. I expect he trains well as well. And don't get me wrong - "good" Mustafi isn't exactly a poor man's Virgil van Dijk. What is so mind blowing is how impactful his blunders are. And it doesn't help when he used to consistently look around and yell at teammates when he just did something horrific to cause a goal or penalty or whatever. At least he seems to have lost that.

    Quote Originally Posted by CNEW2 View Post
    Nice little fact that David Luiz has had two Red Cards his entire Premier League career...Once with Chelsea against Arsenal; the other with Arsenal against Chelsea

    I remember watching a few games from Mustafi where he was...good. I would say fantastic but those words shouldn't go with him, so I'll stick to good. Anything that went into the box, he was there to clear. He made block, after block and seemed like a brick wall for the entirety of the game (can't remember who it was against unfortunately) but then he does stuff like this...and you just wonder how it can possibly be the same guy. For awhile I thought he was just the scapegoat for an inconsistent defense, but he is just an ok to mediocre CB who has WAY too many laugh-out-loud moments. Even as an Arsenal fan, his mistakes have become comical, it's gone past infuriating.

    Either way, Martinelli is amazing, can't wait to ship him off to Barca in 2 years or so for around 20-25mil.
    Pretty much what I mean about Mustafi. He has these runs where he is error-free and reasonably reliable. And that seems to lull managers into thinking he can be utilized. Because managers always think they can iron our inconsistency, much like they think they can take that talented but mercurial and moody attacking player than keeps getting chance after chance.

    Man that Martinelli run.... a thing of beauty. but we can stave off the Barcelona transfer if we give them a cut-rate deal on Abamayeng!

    Quote Originally Posted by Ed View Post
    I have to say, was pretty impressed with Arsenal's spirit to keep fighting to get that draw. I wrote the game off as soon as Luiz saw red. Maybe Arteta can be the guy to change the soft mentality at the club.

    Southampton really reaping the rewards of not panicking and sacking their manager after the 9-0 when they looked doomed to a relegation battle.

    Sergio Aguero doing what he does best again. One goal off Vardy now, golden boot race is on, although you can see Pep resting him for cup games with the league being dead and buried, may cost him. His minutes per goal is sensational though:

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football...ue/top-scorers

    Aston Villa can get fucked.
    Every Gooner did the same thing, Ed. Such a different feeling draw to the one against Sheffield the other week. To his credit (gross), Mustafi played pretty well the rest of the match, which showed more mental fortitude than he usually does after a gaff.

    I really wonder if Augero is going to one of those players who never gets the widespread respect he deserves, or its just going to happen after he leaves the league?

    Quote Originally Posted by Shock View Post
    I'm impressed with Arteta. In a lot of ways it's good for him and the team that this season is a write off. He can instill a gameplan and philosophy ready to go next year.

    The results aren't totally there yet, but Arsenal don't look lifeless anymore. They actually seem to have an idea of what sort of team they want to be.
    Exactly why we are enjoying things again, Shock. Some of us want results and nothing else matters, but most of us have some understanding that it will take time. Showing fight, making progress, coming together... these are all positive developments and a stark change from what we had under Emery.
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  2. #442
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    Re: Premier League 2019/2020 Discussion Thread

    Another chance to close on the top 4, another crap selection and more crap from Andreas....when will it end? Oh yeah in the summer when new players may be brought in haha. Really frustrating first half again.
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    Re: Premier League 2019/2020 Discussion Thread

    Saw a replay of Martinelli's run from a different angle, when Kante slipped he tried so desperately to grab Martinelli by his foot...given Arsenal's luck when it comes to referee decisions, I'd imagine only a yellow would've followed

    I'd rather not give them a cut-rate deal on Auba, while I love Lacazette and feel he brings so much to the team, unfortunately he just seems to be stuck inbetween goal-scoring drought and being unselfish, which is where Auba cleans up. I'd like to see those two up front with Pepe/Martinelli out on the wings and Ozil behind, feel like it could really cause major headaches for teams. If only that defense wasn't so tragic.

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    Re: Premier League 2019/2020 Discussion Thread

    What do you think it will take for the club to call time on the Ole time, Baldrick?

    Quote Originally Posted by CNEW2 View Post
    Saw a replay of Martinelli's run from a different angle, when Kante slipped he tried so desperately to grab Martinelli by his foot...given Arsenal's luck when it comes to referee decisions, I'd imagine only a yellow would've followed

    I'd rather not give them a cut-rate deal on Auba, while I love Lacazette and feel he brings so much to the team, unfortunately he just seems to be stuck inbetween goal-scoring drought and being unselfish, which is where Auba cleans up. I'd like to see those two up front with Pepe/Martinelli out on the wings and Ozil behind, feel like it could really cause major headaches for teams. If only that defense wasn't so tragic.
    A yellow? You jest. The way our luck with refs tends to go, it probably wouldn't have been called as a foul. Or whistled as a foul on Martinelli for running into Kante's hand, like when we had a winner wiped out because a defender shoved Chambers into another player and Sokratis' goal was chalked off.

    I'm torn on Auba. Probably my favorite Gooner right now. But we continue to play him out of position, because he can't do things up top that Lacazette and other strikers do. But his strike rate is ridiculous. The 18 months on his contract factor is pretty huge. Do we commit to a 31 year old striker at 400K per week until he's 35? That seems like a poor decision. Especially for a player who predicates their success so much on their physical pace. I hope he can adapt physically, but I wouldn't want to wager on it to that extent.

    I don't think we would ever see an attacking combo of Auba and Laca up front, Martinelli and Pepe on the wings, and Ozil somewhere behind... because that's 3 players who do almost no defensive work and 2 who try but aren't necessarily that effective. We would need a defense like we had in Wenger's first days to make that workable lol
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    Re: Premier League 2019/2020 Discussion Thread

    Always tough to go to Old Trafford and get a result, but United tried their best tonight.


    I don't think Pereira would get a game for another Premier League team. Even our shit midfield would keep him out the team. Might as well play with a training cone on the field.

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    Re: Premier League 2019/2020 Discussion Thread

    No idea Papa. Realistically he is 5th with this transitional squad however he is very lucky no bugger outside of the top 3 wants to put points on the board week in week out so I'd imagine there's no pressure on him from the powers that be.

    Me personally I'd keep him until EOS then move him to the DoF role as he has the right ideas he just can't get it done with that idiot Woodward and Ole himself is tactically way out too often.

    Nothing will change on a positive front until Woodward isn't in charge of transfers not that he'll give that up.

    The fans tonight made a statement by leaving early it's up to the Glazers now to either get a DoF in play or spend the bloody money on a player like Bruno Fernandes otherwise we'll see a lot more fan uprisings.

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    Re: Premier League 2019/2020 Discussion Thread

    It's almost as if giving the job to a manager who failed at Cardiff was unbelievably naive.

    I know people will say, yeah but they're still 5th, give him time and money. Utd are closer to Newcastle in 14th than they are to Chelsea in 4th, their position means nothing right now and without Rashford you really could see others gaining on them.
    Last edited by Ed; 01-22-2020 at 09:22 PM.

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    Re: Premier League 2019/2020 Discussion Thread

    Manchester United are 4 points above Steve Bruce's Newcastle. The fuck is going on?

    Ole reminds me a lot of Unai in a lot of ways. Clearly out of his depth and too stuck in his ways to make the necessary changes until he's forced to do it. Only difference is, Unai had no effinity with us, so we had no qualms about calling for his head when we started throwing away 2-0 leads on the regular. ManU over the last few games have just looked limp. I have no doubts that either Maguire or James is gonna get injured next, purely because they've been ran into the ground and it's starting to show. Rashford is out for 6-8 months, and if United don't buy, like, right now, they'll lose 2 more to injury

    Also, to add on to Eds point, to get the time and money people will want to give him, he needs to earn that, if not by getting results, then at least by playing a style of football and having a CLEAR plan. What is Uniteds vision? It very clearly isn't youth, theyre playing Mata, Matic and Lingard over the likes of Angel Gomes and Mason Greenwood. Their style of sitting back and hitting opponents is cowardly for a club of Uniteds supposed stature and only really works when the team you're playing underestimate you (City, Spurs, Arsenal, Liverpool). Like, if you could see what he was trying to do you could at least say let him bring in more guys, but no one has a clue
    Last edited by Chaddes; 01-22-2020 at 09:20 PM.

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    Re: Premier League 2019/2020 Discussion Thread

    I even think it's worse with Ole than Emery. Emery's Arsenal was miserable but at least you could point to his time at Sevilla and say there's a good manager in there somewhere. You can't do that with Solskjaer.

    Ed's point about the league being deceiving is spot on. They're behind Chelsea in 5th, while Chelsea are: a team in a transitional year; also wildly inconsistent; even more reliant on youth; haven't been able to make any purchases since losing their best player.

    Saw that Man Utd have lost to 6 of the bottom 10 this season, which is pretty awful. That's what is indicative of Ole being hopeless - he has zero answers for playing against anyone that doesn't allow them to counter attack. Last night's result was predictable just like every other time.

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    Re: Premier League 2019/2020 Discussion Thread

    I can't believe how bad our record is against the bottom teams in the league. How do you get over 70% possession and not score a single goal? Against Burnley no less, who have been shot this season. Unbelievable.
    I don't believe that the manager is the main problem, i honestly think it's the players we have in our squad and the board, Woodward and the Glazers.
    Matic needs to go. He was absolutely dogshit last night. A player who's the complete opposite of what our mentality is under Ole. He slowed play down and single handedly killed the game dead in its tracks all by himself on too many occasions. Lingard needs to go. Pereira needs to go. He's had ample opportunity to show his potential but he isn't showing it often enough. He wouldn't get into any of the leagues top half teams. Jones needs to go. I even say that we need to cash in on Pogpa too at this point. I know he's currently injured but whenever he's played this season he couldn't have looked more disinterested if he tried. Great player but he isn't for us I don't think. Off to Madrid with him.
    With Rashford out injured why isn't Greenwood getting a start? He's a man in form and yet for some reason were playing James, who is out of form. I'll admit that's a question we have to ask of Ole but it is strange.

    I'm so pessimistic about us getting anyone in this January. The Fernandes deal has looked as good as done for so long now I expect it to fall through. We desperately need a striker to cover Rashford as we can't rely on Martial (as good as Rashford and Martial are together it seems that one can't play without the other). I'd take Dembele or why don't we just go and get Cavani, who has handed in a transfer request and PSG are willing to sell? We're talking about loan deals but is that a solution? Not really. Anyone available on loan is either out of favour at their own team and therefore out of form or isn't wanted by their own team. We don't need offcuts from other teams.
    Last edited by Tommy Thunder; 01-23-2020 at 04:09 AM.

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    Re: Premier League 2019/2020 Discussion Thread

    Its weird how many parallels there are between United and Arsenal over the past few years. The indifferent foreign ownership that views the club as nothing more than an investment. Managers who can't effect change.

    I've said this before, but fans leaving, fan protest, or even empty stands... none of that will matter. The Glazers don't give a single fuck about any you. I have zero belief they care about results at all. Just the ledgers. The Kroenke's are exactly the same, no matter what Josh Kroenke claims. Whereas Arsenal have at least had some undeniable financial decline over the past few years (compounded by paying stupid high wages for underperforming players), that hasn't happened to United. You lot are still financially strong, so... there is no "catalyst for change" for the ownership. It will take a consistently half-empty Old Trafford to make them take fan disconnect seriously... and even, those seats are paid for so its really just about perception to sponsors. And honestly, expecting fans who have paid for their tickets to stay home.... not really workable.

    You aren't effective in the transfer market because you don't have a proper structure. As we didn't for a long time and now that we do have a better structure... we still fucking suck in the transfer market.

    I agree and disagree about the differences between Ole and Emery, Shock. Agree in the sense that yes, Emery has a track record of success whereas Ole doesn't. But at the same time, it doesn't really feel like Ole has lost the players. Emery did and that gradually became painfully obvious. He couldn't communicate what he wanted to do very effectively (and it wasn't down the language barrier - multiple Spanish-speakers have said he has an opaque way of speaking even in Spanish). That confusion was a major cause of the tactical breakdown and the players losing trust in the manager. I don't get the impression that lack of trust has really happened with Ole. Some players probably aren't making a full effort on a consistent basis and his tactical approach is very limited against certain opponents. the lack of a positive history definitely made it easier to "turn" on Emery.

    It will be interesting to see how long United will stick with Ole if nothing changes. Football executives don't see things the same way fans do. There were some Gooners starting to say Emery had to go after we utterly mailed in the end of last season and failed to show up for the Europa League final (I was, sadly, among those who thought that was too early) and it certainly became obvious even fairly in this season that he was failing badly. Yet the Arsenal shot-caller was pushing to give him a contract extension even as this season was off to a terrible start.
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    Re: Premier League 2019/2020 Discussion Thread

    Have to say I agree with Shock. We should have sacked Emery after the Leicester game, but we persisted for another 2 games. Ultimately though, we got rid. ManU have stuck by with Ole after some, frankly, embarrassing losses. Like, with all due respect, you're comfortably getting beaten by fucking Burnley. Newcastle youth players are scoring against them. Dropping points to West Ham, Watford, who were bottom of league at the time, comfortably smashing them, and they STILL persist. Plus, there's a big chance if he sacked Emery earlier we would have got Mourinho, which.... Nah fuck right off.

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    Re: Premier League 2019/2020 Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Chaddes View Post
    Have to say I agree with Shock. We should have sacked Emery after the Leicester game, but we persisted for another 2 games. Ultimately though, we got rid. ManU have stuck by with Ole after some, frankly, embarrassing losses. Like, with all due respect, you're comfortably getting beaten by fucking Burnley. Newcastle youth players are scoring against them. Dropping points to West Ham, Watford, who were bottom of league at the time, comfortably smashing them, and they STILL persist. Plus, there's a big chance if he sacked Emery earlier we would have got Mourinho, which.... Nah fuck right off.
    I am exceptionally happy we got Arteta over Mourinho lol

    But yeah, we waited too long to pull the trigger. But again, reports are that Raul wanted to give Emery an extension not too far before we finally fired the guy. which says a lot about Raul and his judgement, to be honest. I really don't trust the man at all anymore. Going all the way back to our last 4-5 matches of the league season last year, we didn't have a 2-3 match run where we looked like things were really turning around. The club was persisting with Emery based on partial periods of play within a match. Literally that statement from the club after the Leicester match was about how we played well for a period of the match before getting trashed, and it talked about how far ahead of us as a club Leicester is, which is patently absurd when you consider they fired their manager a year before and have nowhere near the resources we do.
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    Re: Premier League 2019/2020 Discussion Thread

    Ole has the majority of the players on his side. They are still trying for him which is something, it's just they lack the bloody quality to put in consistent performances, it really doesn't matter who the manager is at this point, with this current squad they aren't going to get much better outcomes. The mistakes lay with whomever decided it was acceptable not to bring in a striker as cover after letting Lukaku and Sanchez go, it's lays with whomever was responsible for not replacing Fellaini and Herrera in the middle of the park. If that is purely on Ole then he needs to go, as that isn't the case as it's on the heads of Joel Glazer and Ed Woodward then they need to sort themselves out.

    Sad thing is the Glazers won't look to sell until the money stops coming in, so unfortunately for us Man Utd fans we've got a bit of a long wait for things to improve longer term.
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    Re: Premier League 2019/2020 Discussion Thread

    I feel like Ole hasn't lost the dressing room because other than Pogba who hardly plays atm, there's no big personalities getting frustrated at the situation and questioning his management. Far too many of them are just happy to be there because it's Manchester United, the biggest club in the world, because they're young players who haven't experienced anything better, or they're players who aren't top 4 quality so this is as good as it'll ever get for them, or players right at the end of their career who are happy to get the big wages like Matic and Mata. They're like the wrestlers who have signed up for NXT UK, overly grateful for the opportunity to have the famous logo on their tracksuits and they just accept the mediocrity of what they're producing. They have no leaders on the pitch, it says it all when Slabhead gets the club captaincy after half of season of being with them because of the lack of options. I'm not sure how you fix the many problems at United, but I really think they could use some stronger characters in the dressing room.

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    Re: Premier League 2019/2020 Discussion Thread

    The lack of quality players/injuries to our best players is the main cause of our results but yes that leads back to Ed Woodward and Matt Judge's recruitment and how incompetent they are at it.
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    Re: Premier League 2019/2020 Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Ed View Post
    I feel like Ole hasn't lost the dressing room because other than Pogba who hardly plays atm, there's no big personalities getting frustrated at the situation and questioning his management. Far too many of them are just happy to be there because it's Manchester United, the biggest club in the world, because they're young players who haven't experienced anything better, or they're players who aren't top 4 quality so this is as good as it'll ever get for them, or players right at the end of their career who are happy to get the big wages like Matic and Mata. They're like the wrestlers who have signed up for NXT UK, overly grateful for the opportunity to have the famous logo on their tracksuits and they just accept the mediocrity of what they're producing. They have no leaders on the pitch, it says it all when Slabhead gets the club captaincy after half of season of being with them because of the lack of options. I'm not sure how you fix the many problems at United, but I really think they could use some stronger characters in the dressing room.
    Very true. the only player outside of Pogba who i could see kicking up a stink there is De Gea...and i don't think he cares enough (Probably because he know's his agent could get him a big money move in the summer if worst comes to worst). It doesn't really help when Pogba basically gets ridiculed for speaking against it, even though most of what he says about the club is currently true.

    It's gonna take a hell of a lot to fix the issues at Man U


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